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Rafe Judkins: Hey everyone. As you may know already, I'm Rafe Judkins, I'm the showrunner of The Wheel of Time TV series on Amazon Prime. I know it seems like we say this every year at this point, but we are so sad that we can't be at JordanCon with you. The Wheel weaves, the world intervenes, and we're actually still shooting season two of Wheel of Time here in Morocco.
I'm on set right now and there's actually a pretty iconic fight scene from the books being rehearsed right around that corner. I don't think Amazon is going to let us turn that camera and show it to you, but you'll see it on your TV screens sometime soon.
Because we can't be there, we've tried to gather some of the creative team, actors, crew to answer some of your burning questions, give you some information about what we're doing with season two, answer some of the things that you are wondering about from season one.
And we've actually gotten permission to give you an exclusive first piece of news, which is casting. It's the casting of probably my favorite character in the books, Aviendha. So I'd like to announce here at JordanCon for the very first time that the role of Aviendha will be played on Wheel of Time by the amazing actress Ayoola Smart.
Ayoola's been fantastic. She is a part of the fight scene that's happening right around the corner right now. So it feels very fitting to be announcing her in this place where we're seeing her months of hard, work learning how to use spears, how to do flips, how to hull up a veil and convey a death glare with her eyes, all come into play. This woman is gonna make you very very excited to see more of the world of the Aiel. So Ayoola, welcome to Wheel of Time. Everyone, start Googling her now.
So thank you guys so much for all of the support that you've given not only to us, but to this incredible book series, which is the reason that we're all here and working in Morocco. The premiere was incredible. The response to season one and the number of viewers who tuned in blew away any expectations that anyone had, and that all comes down to you guys. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you from all of us. We will now throw it to our amazing cast and crew, and me, to answer some of your questions.
Question 1 - Favorite shooting location[]
Timestamp: 02:35
Question 1: What's been your favorite shooting location & why?
Daniel Henney: My favorite location so far has been Italy. We shot some stuff for season two last September. We went to an area close to Bari, which is in the southern tip down by the heel of the boot. I'd never been there, and I had no idea what to expect. So it was was pretty special. The landscape, being so close to the Mediterranean, our hotel was right in the cliffs of the ocean. I know you guys hate me right now. It was beautiful.
The stuff that we shot for Lan and Moiraine was really powerful and exciting for us as actors to get into that storyline. So it was a really beautiful experience. I was able to stay for about a week and a half afterwards before going back to Prague and have a little mini vacation, which was great. So that was by far my favorite location.
Question 2 - Playing another character[]
Timestamp: 03:37
Question 2: If you had to be another character on The Wheel of Time who would it be?
Marcus Rutherford: I would be Lan. I think there's a similarity in his quiet reserved stoicism that Perrin also has. But there's a fierceness, a warrior-like quality to him that's really badass, and I think the way Daniel plays him is so so cool.
Question 3 - Playing Liandrin[]
Timestamp: 04:04
Question 3: What has been your favorite part of bringing Liandrin to life?
Kate Fleetwood: I think the lovely thing about having been given the great opportunity to bring Liandrin to life is that the writers have created a really sort of layered interpretation of her. I think she's very different from how people might have seen her in the books. And certainly as an actor, you're always looking for as many dimensions to play, and you're certainly looking for the scratch and the friction in the character.
And I think like so many of the characters in the books, themes in the books, it's not always exactly as you might imagine it to be. There's always something very hidden deeper to the characters than you might think of originally. So I've really enjoyed the playfulness of Liandrin. But there's a deeper and a darker side to Liandrin. But also her own personal backstory. I've really been able to immerse myself in the second season which has been a real gift.
She's very, like a lot of the character, mercurial. She's very different when she's with different people and that's always fun to play as an actor, cuz you're always just looking for the widest lens to look at a character through. So I'm always really excited when I get a new script and there's definitely some surprises in store in season two. I just love playing her because there's always so many different choices you can make, things you can play with.
Question 4 - Favorite aspect of your character[]
Timestamp: 05:45
Question 4: What's your favorite aspect of your characters?
Hammed Animashaun: My favorite aspect of my character is probably his gullible-ishness. I find Loial very innocent. I think that's why he's one of the favorites of the series. He's just very innocent.
Question 5 - Costume versions[]
Timestamp: 06:12
Question 5: Are there multiple versions of the same costumes? More detailed for close ups, & more practical for fight & horse riding scenes?
Isis Mussenden: We have multiples for stunts and horse riding and specific stunts that maybe have little tricky needs for more room in the thigh or more room to straddle the horse on the saddle and such, or maybe for rigging underneath. So yes, the answer is we do have practical versions of the same thing, but they're not designed differently, they're just adjusted for the specific stunt.
And no, we don't do different versions for close ups. The hero pieces, which is what we call the pieces for camera, is done one hundred percent, always to the same level so that we can make sure that if the camera comes in for a close up, or pulls away, that the costume's always ready.
Question 6 - LGBTQIA+ relationships[]
Timestamp: 07:15
Question 6: Are there any plans to include other LGBTQIA+ relationships in the show?
Rafe Judkins: We predominantly in the show have been trying to take things that were suggested or hinted at being LGBTQIA+ relationships in the books and sort of expanding on them, bringing those out, letting us know more about those characters and their feelings for each other, or taking things that we don't know what the relationship is between those two people and giving them something. And I think that's what we'll continue to do with the show the whole way through the series. You will see us lean into those places that are already so present in the books and then try to find room to tell more of the emotional history of some of those characters, and a lot of times that will include their relationships with people, be they of the same gender, a different one, or ungendered.
Question 7 - Behind the scenes story[]
Timestamp: 08:06
Question 7: What's your favorite behind the scenes story from production?
Daniel Henney: There's just a lot of micro things that happen throughout the season that are kind of stories, kind of little anecdotes. I think the funniest things are just relationships like Zoe and Maddie are literally sisters. It's the funniest thing, it's really beautiful to watch. They've really bonded, as we all have. But those two. And I always get stuck, sort of, in the tent next to them. We have tents, right, where when we have downtime on set, we have our tent, we can go back to those. There's food in there. There's a heater so we can go to get warmed up. It's pretty chilly sometimes when we shoot. And those two are never in– They're always in the tent together, one of their tents. And they're always talking. And they've made up their own language, like when you're in school, like middle school, and you make up a language with your friends, and they do that, they have this language. I got stuck in a truck with them in Slovenia. Like the first a month of production, we're in Slovenia. And I had to go from the airport to our hotel with them, which is like three hours. I felt like the dad on family vacation, like I just needed to get out of the car and find a place to have a beer because they were so, they had so much energy and they wouldn't stop talking that. [Mimics energetic talking.] They just have this like squeaky energy. It's just Lan, the two girls, and the car the whole way, it was hilarious. And I've got some video, I'm gonna post a bit eventually, so stay tuned.
Question 8 - Filming in the Hall[]
Timestamp: 09:46
Question 8: What was it like filming that incredible scene in the Hall with all the sitters of the different Ajahs?
Kate Fleetwood: The great scene in the hall was an amazing scene to play. It was the first time we'd all convened in the white tower and it was a brilliant scene to play because it was so epic and the scale of it comes across beautifully in the photography in that scene. And of course it's just women, which is just fantastic to have that opportunity to play with different actresses really. I mean, I love playing with actors as well, but it's just unusual to have so many female voices in one room, and extremely powerful voices in one room at the same time. And it was just glorious to see all the different representations, different [architecture]. And also working Sophie and Rosamund and Priyanka and all those brilliant actresses and Jen, all under one roof– one enormous roof, as it was– was just thrilling. I remember getting home that day and emailing Sally our director and saying, "Oh my gosh, I just so enjoyed that today." Felt like being in a stage production, a sort of collective group of actors together is always where you make your best work. So it was really thrilling to be able to share that and create that together.
Questions 9 - Loial's costume[]
Timestamp: 11:20
Question 9: What was the process in creating Loial's costume and how many books can he fit in his pockets?
Hammed Animashaun: The process in creating Loial's costume was very much a collaborative process. The showrunner Rafe, director Sally, and all the heads of departments in costume, hair and makeup, prosthetics, it was all about making it as practical as possible and also as comfortable as possible for me. But also trying to stay as truthful to the books as possible, but also creating a brand new character for new viewers and for new people coming into the series. And he can fit 25 books in his pockets. Full fledged novels.
Question 10 - Favorite costume[]
Timestamp: 12:10
Question 10: What was your favorite costume to design and why?
Isis Mussenden: Well that's impossible. It's The Wheel of Time, there were a million fabulous costumes that I enjoyed designing and I loved it because this is what I do. Specifically, you know, Moiraine of course, and the five heroes, they took a lot of thought and trial and error to get to that place for them for this particular first season, which we're really excited about. Working with the leather workers, Rob Goodwin, and the bolero, her armor, for Moiraine, was a real challenge and really satisfying at the end of the day because it really changed who she was, it changed who Rosamund Pike was, which is what's important. I love doing the armies, I love Valda's army with like 26 pieces in that skirt. We printed fabric, we made armor. I love Agelmar and Amalisa's armor, that was also a couple of my favorite pieces. Siuan in the hall. So there are many pieces. Why? Because it was a great project to work on.
Question 11 - Blood snow choreography[]
Timestamp: 13:20
Question 11: How difficult was the choreography in the blood snow scene? Did the bolt camera make it easier? How many takes did it take?
Rafe Judkins: How many takes did it take to shoot? We should talk about how many days it took to shoot, probably, which was four. You know, a fight scene like this is a massive undertaking and we're lucky enough on this show that we can have time to put into some of those fight scenes and really devote a big chunk of the production to making them happen. And everyone's involved in that, rehearsals for the fight started months beforehand. We found Magdalena almost a year before we even started choreographing that scene and worked it towards her because we thought she was so incredible. And so the stunt team, led by Jan Petrina, built the fight. Ciaran, the director, and I gave notes on it. We continued to work the fight. Then when they actually went to set and got the bolt camera and the moving arm into it, they had to adjust some of the moves of the fight to be able to almost be a dance, not only with the men that she was fighting, but also the camera itself, and make it feel and look seamless. You know, I think that scene looks like a lot went into it, and even more went into it than shows on screen.
Question 12 - Prop you want to keep[]
Timestamp: 14:40
Question 12: Is there any prop that you wish you could keep?
Daniel Henney: I mean come on guys, it's the sword. It's Lan's sword. I hope that one day I will get one. I've been on a journey with that thing for three years now and there's many iterations of the sword. There's the actual battle sword, there's a stunt sword, there's a horse riding sword, there's a plastic sword for practice, and sheaths and scabbards to compliment those swords because we need to have it work for various situations. So the sword is very special to me and I do feel like Lan is complete when I finally get the sword and scabbard on my back and everything is clicking. So that for me is the prop that I would love to have.
Question 13 - Inspiration for Siuan's robe[]
Timestamp: 15:20
Question 13: What was the inspiration for Siuan's Amyrlin's Seat ceremonial robe?
Isis Mussenden: There were so many factors that needed to go into that robe. First of all, she needed to stand above and beyond everybody. She's also, Siuan, from Tier, and Tier culturally had to come a bit of a Cambodian background, Southeast Asia feel to it. As you all know, Robert Jordan was in the Vietnam War, and this is where a lot of his inspiration came from. We'd also given a motif of the paisley motif to Tier, which is basically, a paisley can be a dragon's tooth one way or the other. Putting all these together, combined with a really fantastic trip to India, to New Delhi that I made, to look for fabrics. We found the beautiful gold fabrics that we made the costume with. So I had drawn it up before, but really got the textures together with these fabrics from India. And the reason it needed to be gold was because we had the seven colors of the Aes Sedai, and it really needed to be gold, not yellow, it couldn't be reddish, and we didn't have any other colors and of course what is the most precious of all metals is gold. So that was the inspiration for Siuan. A little bit of the Southeast Asian, sleeves of the Philippines, mixed with Cambodian pieces, and the paisley motif, and her golden gown in her dragon tooth sleeve motif.
Question 14 - Practical effects[]
Timestamp: 17:09
Question 14: Are we going to see a lot of practical effects in season 2 or more visual/CGI effects?
Rafe Judkins: Yeah I mean, always on the show we're trying to do as many practical effects as we can. That's what we like to do, we like to do a combination of practical and CGI as well, so that you hopefully are never looking at the show and going, "Oh that's a cool CGI effect," or, "a not cool CGI effect." That you are really immersed in the world and falling into it. Obviously, COVID created a situation where we had to rely on CGI a lot more than we would have otherwise. And in season two, we are doing more blending of the two. So hopefully that'll play successfully.
Question 15 - Favorite artwork[]
Timestamp: 17:50
Question 15: Could you share with us your favorite artwork (any medium)?
Daniel Henney: My favorite artwork is always changing so that's a tough question. My mom paints, I started painting when I was younger, and I still do when I have time. Just oil on canvas. I enjoy that medium. Yeah so, I mean, I recently was in Prague at the Dali and the Warhol and the Mucha exhibit. There's this exhibit in old town square and there's a Czech artist, his name is, I think it's pronounced, Alphonse Mucha, and I'm really really intrigued by his work. There's one called News, it's really beautiful. And it's really cool, it's kind of, it's like Turner's– it's what was, hous– like 1850 to 1945, that range. It was kind of during the war, World War One and Two was beginning, and his art was really prominent, and there's a pop art feel to it with also sort of this like propaganda satire as well, and the colors he uses are really really incredible. I'm doing a terrible job of describing it, you'd have to look him up. But I've been really into Mucha and I bought a couple books with his work in it. So that's kind of what I'm into right now.
Question 16 - Polyamorous relationships[]
Timestamp: 19:15
Question 16: How did you approach representing polyamorous relationships, and do you have a plan for exploring those in later seasons?
Rafe Judkins: Our approach to polyamorous relationships is the same as our approach to any other relationships on the show. We're trying to take what's there in the books, try to give you more insight into the emotional interior of all those characters and understand what they feel and why they do the things that they do. And so you see a lot more actually in season two of one of those relationships, the Alanna-Maksim-Ihvon relationship, we get to delve into more of that and understand a little bit more how those three parts fit together, and how there's not just one relationship happening there, there's three relationships.
Question 17 - Funny moment on set[]
Timestamp: 20:01
Question 17: What's the funniest moment that happened on set?
Daniel Henney: I remember a moment when COVID was first happening and they were kind of trying to protect the set, you know. The trash cans had signs on the top that said "no hands, feet only." And I was kind of having my lunch and I saw Rosamund, she finished her lunch and she walked up to a trash can. And I just noticed her like staring at the sign and she's like, "Are you serious?" She's like, "How am I supposed to open this lid with my feet?" Because it's like a four and a half foot trash can. And I'm just I'm just looking at her, and god I love her so much and I just, I knew there was a pedal. There's a pedal there to push with your feet. But they put the sign on top and said, "no hands feet only," meaning use your foot to press the pedal loop will come up, yada yada. I could have told her. I could have told her. But I didn't. And watching her try to lift the lid with her foot, the top lid with her foot, was a very special moment for all of us. We had some wonderful moments.
And one more that I'll say was in our wonderful Rosamund's defense was, when she won her Golden Globe. She couldn't go to the ceremony because of COVID. I can't quite remember now. But whatever, they sent the award to Prague to our studios and Rafe told me that the award was coming. And so I said, well let me get it first and we'll try to do something with it. And what we did was during one of the scenes we were shooting, the first take, I'd hidden the award in my backpack, or Lan's pack. And as she was speaking, I turned to her in the middle of the scene, and I just said, "We want to thank you so much for who you are, what you do, and how amazing, what an amazing leader you are for us." And I got down on one knee and I pulled out her award mid-scene, and she broke down and it was just really– it wasn't a funny moment, but it was really special moment. I hope one day, somehow, in the behind the scenes, that comes out.
Marcus Rutherford: Funny moments that happened on set, hmm. I remember in season one where Egwene and Perrin meet the tuatha'an, the traveling people, and the scene they've been on the road for ages, so they're starving, they're hungry, and they offer up their food to them. And it's the first time, really, I've had to eat as if I'd been like absolutely starving, ravenous. But usually what happens in those moments is the food in itself that you're eating isn't amazing. So you kind of do a thing of scarfing the food down without actually swallowing it. And then I think at the end of one take, I just looked at Maddie and she'd held all these lentils in her mouth, and we just started laughing and then lentils just came out of her nose, almost out of her ears, and it was just like this lentil mess. And we just realized we haven't actually been eating it the whole time which is a top acting skill that we might see in the show.
Kate Fleetwood: It may be obvious to many people that I'm not a natural horse woman. And I think one of the first times I'd been on a horse on camera was we were taking Logain back to the White Tower. I was at the front of this large caravan of supporting artists and many many horses and carriages and all sorts of things, and I was right at the front, and they shouted, "Action!" And the horse, they're so sensitive, the horses they're brilliant, got very sensitive to the first assistant director shouting action that my horse decided to go very quickly off. It didn't quite bolt but sort of ran off into the front and very unlike Liandrin I shouted, "Help me, help me, help me!" as I went off into the forest. And I was really embarrassed. I was very very embarrassed. And then another funny moment that always makes me laugh, when we're all in the White Tower and we're all like swanning about in our costumes and it reminds me of what it might be like if an alternative streaming version of The Wheel of Time would be called "Aes Sedai High", where we're all sort of mean girls in the White Tower and it's "Aes Sedai High". It always makes me laugh, we're all sort of like swishing about being powerful and certainly I'm being a bit of a school bully.
Hammed Animashaun: I don't know about a funny moment on set, but I do remember Maddie and Zoe always trying to – Maddie and Zoe have this game with Marcus where they tried to tackle him to the ground. Marcus is six-foot-five, pretty big dude, and Zoe and Maddie are lovely women but they're, you know, predominantly smaller. And they have this game where in between takes they try and like tackle Marcus to the ground. And they can never do it. And I find that very funny. So it's just like, Marcus would be standing by himself somewhere and all of a sudden you just see these two girls just like run at him, and he doesn't move an inch. That's funny I think.
Question 18 - Positive feedback[]
Timestamp: 25:13
Question 18: What change in the move from page to screen have you received the most positive feedback about?
Rafe Judkins: You know, it's been amazing, the amount of positive feedback we've received on a lot of the changes, and I
think that one of the main ones is just how we structured the season and built the Aes Sedai and Tar Valon into it. It was really important to me from the very beginning that we had to keep this show on the air, so that we can make it to the end of the story. And I think to do that you have to show off the best parts of The Wheel of Time series right there in the first season. And so getting Rosamund into it, getting Moiraine into it, getting the Aes Sedai into it – that was essential to the success of the show and why it's been such a big hit. So I think that's been really really huge to us. And I think one of the, maybe, emotional changes that we made that has received a ton of positive response has been the Siuan-Moiraine relationship and seeing that brought more to the forefront. You know, it does the same thing we're always trying to do, which is just deepen those characters, understand their emotions, understand why they're doing the things they do, so that people want to follow along with them the way they do when they read the books.
Question 19 - Character theme song[]
Timestamp: 26:29
Question 19: What do you think your characters theme song would be?
Daniel Henney: I would always practice the Lan's [kata] and his, in the winter night fight, whenever I was doing sword sessions to pump myself up, and I'm not like always listening to this kind of music, but I grew up in the midwest, I like some metal, and so I would throw on Drowning Pool - Bodies, that was that song, "let the bodies hit the floor," I would listen to that one. And I would go through all the sword forms and I would do like, is it "Down With a Sickness"? Is that Disturbed? I may be getting this wrong because I'm, yeah I think that's right. But yeah, I would do metal for Lan. I just think it works with him so I would go through hours of sword forms with him listening to heavy metal, and that was what worked for me.
Marcus Rutherford: For Perrin's theme song, I would go with either "Wolves" by Kanye West, or "He's a Good Lad" by Bread.
Kate Fleetwood: What do I think my character's theme song would be? Well I was thinking about this and I think it has to be All By Myself by Eric Carmen. Or the Celine Dion version, but probably the Eric Carmen one, the remastered one. I sort of have this fancy that Liandrin sort of takes out her braids, makes herself a martini, and kicks back to some soft yacht rock in her room, sort of imagining herself a better life. So yeah I think she's a big yacht rock fan. And certainly, "All By Myself" is probably something she knows backwards.
Hammed Animashaun: I think Loial's theme song would be The Golden Girls theme song. Yeah.
Question 20: If you could pick any TV show, past or currently running, to have a crossover with The Wheel of Time, what would it be?
Rafe Judkins: [laughs] This question I should have prepped for but I didn't. I mean, I would just choose something that I love because if you're doing a crossover with The Wheel of Time, you're just doing it to have fun. So I'd love to have a Buffy the Vampire Slayer musical crossover episode with The Wheel of Time. Who knows what that looks like, but if we get some good people to do the music, I think it'd be fun regardless.
Question 21 - Favorite season 1 moment[]
Timestamp: 28:56
Question 21: What's your favorite moment from season 1?
Daniel Henney: I think my favorite moment was simply the first time Rosamund and I walked through the Two Rivers in character and costume as Lan and Moiraine. The actual first scene we shot together was the scene where we've just come out of the Winespring, and we're walking through the town square, the courtyard, and she says, "You didn't sleep last night," and that, "we have work to do," and I just take off on the horse. That was the very first scene we shot together and it was just really amazing that day. You know, you're nervous, you're excited, you're finally starting this journey, you're hoping everything goes well, and it was a beautiful beautiful moment, and you saw all this effort come together with the sets and the costumes and everything. And so it was really special. I mean, the whole first season coming together, starting the show, was very special. The various dinners we had as a cast and crew, just the moments of getting to know each other, the stunt training, there were so many moments, and there are many more to come.
Marcus Rutherford: One key moment I remember from season one is where Perrin has an injury on his leg from the trolloc fight in episode one, and the wolves come out and one of them licks the wound, which heals it. That was a beautiful moment. I didn't know how we were going to film it, but the dog trainers, the dog handlers, are incredible and they put a little bit of meat, sort of like a pâté paste, on the wound, and it hit its marks, it managed to look up to the camera. It was quite amazing, really. You never really know filming with real animals how it's gonna go, but it's really really exciting, especially moving forward into season two to have like real animals to work with. And yeah, they were like so professional. Way way way more professional than me.
Kate Fleetwood: It's a very simple moment, it's after the opening credits to be honest, it's when Nynaeve and Egwene in the Women's Circle, it just sends chills up my spine. When you arrive in that landscape, the green landscape, and then all the women up on the rock, and Zoe and Maddie giving beautifully subtle performances of what this baptism is going to be for them. My favorite moments tend to be the slightly tender, gentle moments, and I think that's something that this show really creates and expands on. Of course it's fantasy, and of course it is epic, and wide, and has huge aperture. But for me, it's always the slightly more romantic moments, and the gentler, subtler moments between characters that give me chills and are my favorite moments.
Hammed Animashaun: My favorite moment in season one would have to be episode four where Nynaeve unleashes her full power to save everyone. That was an amazing moment in season one for me.
Question 22 - Most excited for season 2[]
Timestamp: 32:13
Question 22: What are you most looking forward to fans experiencing in season 2?
Rafe Judkins: Really excited with season two, we've tried to take a chance in this season to spend time with each of the characters individually. And I think it gives you this amazing opportunity to get more into their headspace the way you can in a book when you are reading a chapter from their POV.
So I'm most excited about both book fans but also people who don't know the books as well, to be able to spend time with each of these characters, see what they're like on their own, what they feel, what they want from the world, and be able to track them through the season. Because I think when you have all of the characters moving as a group in a TV show, it can be harder to get into their interior emotional lives. So you know, we're doing all kinds of cool stuff, don't get me wrong, in season two. But that's the thing that I'm most excited about, is for people to just get to know them better, and get to see what they really want, and how they're progressing, because when you get to the end of season two, some of those characters feel almost unrecognizable to who they were at the start of season one.
Question 23 - Tease season 2[]
Question: In five words or less, how can you tease season 2 for us?
Rafe Judkins: Five words or less! Um... We are going to Falme.